The Stories We Tell Ourselves: Owning Your Truth Without the Apology

Episode 8 with Jill and Molly

We all have a narrative running in our heads, the one that shapes how we see ourselves, how we show up, and what we believe we deserve. On this week's episode, Molly and Jill dig into the stories they’ve carried, the ones they’ve rewritten, and the moments when speaking their truth felt risky but necessary.

From confronting limiting beliefs and people-pleasing patterns to navigating vulnerability hangovers and self-worth breakthroughs, this is a real look at what it takes to live unapologetically in a world that loves to hand out labels.

If you’ve ever questioned your own voice, downplayed your needs, or waited for permission to take up space, this episode is your reminder: you don’t need it. Your story is yours to own, rewrite, and tell on your terms.

• TRANSCRIPTION

  Jill Griffin 0:00

  No, it wasn't okay. I forgot to, it's okay. Can you hear me? If I sit back, like this, am I like, good still?

  Unknown Speaker 0:07

  Yeah, it's a little quieter, but it's okay.

  Jill Griffin 0:12

  I don't be yelling, let's be honest, my natural voice just like my daughters.

  Molly Bierman 0:19

  Yeah, I mean, it'll just, it'll just start to escalate as the podcast, you know, time clock begins, so it's fine. You'll start leaving in and screaming.

  Jill Griffin 0:33

  I am really passionate about this topic. Let me tell you, I'm aware. I told a couple people that we were recording on this topic, and I got some unsolicited feedback from people, wow. Like, wow, we love Ian. Ian made a poster for his clinical office. Okay,

  Molly Bierman 0:50

  about it with the with the tagline?

  Jill Griffin 0:53

  No, it wasn't with the tagline, but he was like, Yeah, more people, more people need this information about what what it is, so let's get into it.

  Molly Bierman 1:01

  All right, let's get into it. Welcome back, guys. No permission necessary.

  Jill Griffin 1:08

  Check in. I feel like we didn't do a check in, about, about, uh, how the week's been for us. I know, yeah, we

  Molly Bierman 1:15

  can do a little check in. We can do a little check in. I mean, look, I ate McDonald's last night. So it's not just, Well,

  Speaker 1 1:27

  just sums up how Molly's week is going. She capped it off with the MC level,

  Molly Bierman 1:31

  yeah. And I really believe, I really believe, you know, it's talking to a friend of mine last night, and I said it's not going to be good, like I have to work out at 6am okay? I have a trainer coming to the house, so can't just dodge her. She's gonna be at the front door. And I got a podcast, and then I have a stacked day of work.

  Jill Griffin 1:54

  Was this conversation before you made the choice to eat the McDonald's or after

  Molly Bierman 1:59

  I called a different friend before I made the choice. Oh,

  Jill Griffin 2:03

  so it was like, You were ready to relapse, and you called and just co you're like, I'm doing it anyway.

  Molly Bierman 2:09

  No, no, this particular friend that I called prior to going. I was like, I think I just want to go get Chick fil A real quick. Like, I just, I just gone to a meeting. I was, you know, I needed, like, a snack. I really just wanted a slice of pizza, okay, but I live in Maryland, and the problem here is that the pizza guys, the pizza is so bad describe it. That's what I mean.

  Jill Griffin 2:38

  Oh, so anyway, Haven today, but I'm not getting pizza.

  Molly Bierman 2:43

  Well, you should for me. So that's all I was thinking about. Was like, can I just get, like, a quick slice of pizza? You know, like, these are the problems that I have today. And it diverted to McDonald's really quick. Well, originally, Chick fil A, Chick fil A happens to be under construction. Wasn't aware, and I called one of my girlfriends, and she was like, McDonald's always over, Chick fil A. And I'm like, No, I see I'm like, sick, even just thinking about it. Okay,

  Speaker 1 3:12

  so, but how did you feel this morning?

  Molly Bierman 3:15

  This morning, when I woke up, I was like, oh my god, I have 15 minutes. First of all, I woke up late, obviously, I mean, I did check my oura ring, and sleep wasn't that bad. I had good sleep. I didn't have optimal sleep, but I had good sleep if

  Jill Griffin 3:31

  I eat McDonald's, I'm telling you right now, it's instant shame and regret. It's it's instant, instant, like I'm trash, like it's because I know that I'm not gonna feel good, and I know what I just did to myself, and I just exactly

  Molly Bierman 3:47

  and then I was down a rabbit hole. Okay, then I'm on a rabbit a rabbit hole on Instagram about somehow it diverted me to health and wellness. And, you know, we're in a shame spiral. What are they? Hyperbaric chambers, like, what? Where am I? I'm in a total shave spiral. I have that's why

  Speaker 1 4:08

  you went to sauna this morning. You went to sauna to sweat out the McDonald's. Exactly,

  Molly Bierman 4:14

  I'm not kidding you. I texted my girlfriends and I was like, I don't like I

  Jill Griffin 4:21

  smell like McDonald's. I

  Molly Bierman 4:25

  don't know what it smelled like, but it was not good. Okay, we've recovered well, and I'm telling you that happens once a year, but I will blame right now, Ian, if you're listening, Ian posted, you posted about McDonald's a couple days ago, and it got into my brain. It got into my body. I mean, I'm texting Alyssa last night, telling her what's happening, and she's like, I've been also thinking about McDonald's for a few days.

  Jill Griffin 4:58

  I saw that video. And wanted to vomit. Okay, so it did not inspire me in that same way. However, I will say I did eat Chick fil A this week. It was delicious. No no shame or regret from Chick fil A. I don't know what it is. I don't know if they cook. They cook with, do they cook with peanut oil? Or that's five guys. I don't know. I don't know. I don't feel to me the seed oils isn't good. But I just didn't feel I also it was after a three hour doctor appointment with the kids. So like, I was starving. So I feel

  Molly Bierman 5:31

  like, yeah, and your nervous system was like, Give me something that I could just like,

  Jill Griffin 5:35

  I don't know. It was fine. It was fine. I just have had my week. I recognize today, just giving myself some grace, I owner of essentially four businesses at this point, okay, right? Each business is going through its own expansion right now. Yeah, in transition, transition expansion. I am in a season of expansion right now, and I had like a moment, like a fear moment this week, and

  Unknown Speaker 6:09

  it, oh, wait, you have to tell me about it.

  Jill Griffin 6:13

  I well, I have this mo so I took on some new space. And it's just like a lot of money going out for this space, right? And then real estate, essentially, real estate, yeah, and then, and then, you know, there's the other piece of we're in a service business, so we have to have a certain number of services booked right to cover expenses and blah, blah, blah. And I have learned in my leadership style that I have to pause and slow down because I will get fearful. This has been over time that I've noticed this. I will have a fear, and then I will react by like, barking out orders, not in like, a mean way, but I'll just like, fire off, like that same I fire off the action steps to my team, and then the response is like, whoa, whoa, like, because maybe we just had a whole different conversation. Yesterday. I was calm, cool, collected. Now today, it's like, Nope, we're switching gears. We're doing XYZ. Totally unhinged. Orients the team, right? It makes them kind of like, Did I do something wrong? Like, the reaction is just not what I it's not good. It's not where I want to lead from. I don't want to lead from fear. So I had this moment, set off some emails, and then afterwards, I texted them, and I was like, my leadership team, and I was like, Listen, guys, I had a moment. I'm gonna own it. I had a moment, and I'm over that. Like, I It's a fear of this. And I stated the fear and that, to me, is like leading from vulnerability, which, you know, is a whole episode that we can talk about but it was a, honestly, a big growth moment for me, because it's more comfortable for me to just not live in fear necessarily, but just like, get the action out and then make like, in my mind, it's taken care of, so I don't have to be afraid anymore. I think is what happens. But I just listen. I needed them. I needed to be more clear about, like, Listen, this is why this is important, these steps that we need to take. And also, like, where I'm because I don't always share the ownership Pete, like, I do a little bit more now, but like, I take out 100% of the responsibility, right as a sole owner, and so I don't always, like put that on them, because it's not theirs to own. However, in this case, they are aware of what this is costing. They are aware and in a different way now than maybe when we've expanded in the past. So I don't know it was good, but the bottom line is, I had to give myself grace, like, listen, there's a lot going on, and you're actually holding it together. And also, Mercury's in retrograde, and we just need to, we just need to get through. It's over August 11. We're gonna survive.

  Molly Bierman 8:45

  Oh, Lord, 10 more days. Well, I will tell you that I have a similar story. I was starting at a new organization in leadership, and I walked into a management meeting, and I was working with my husband, okay? And there was a bunch of people sit around, you know, seated around the table, maybe like 10, eight to 10 mid level managers. And I don't even remember the context of what I was amped about, right? But I was amped about something, and people who had worked for me for an extended period of time, like, know, when I am What fire described, calm, cool, collected or fired up. I don't even have to open my mouth. And they're like, Okay, we're just gonna buckle up. We're just gonna brace ourselves for whatever is about to come down the bike and but through this experience at this new company, I like, went off on something, some sort of challenge I was having, or felt like somebody should be doing something differently. Typically, I'm like, frustrated with another department, whatever the case may be, and I remember leaving that office, and I think I just talked to Sam about this not that long ago. I remember leaving that office and being like, I. I'm gonna have to send all these people that I've never really worked with before, and, like, I'm telling you I was probably in the first, like, couple of months working with this team, that I need to make amends. I need to send an email apologize. Yeah, and I did. I sent an email to the management thread and said, you know, like,

  Jill Griffin 10:23

  I'm sorry for my unhinged behavior. Correct?

  Molly Bierman 10:25

  I had to. I was like, I can't go walk back into that management meeting next week and actually get that was like, That was well adjusted behavior.

  Jill Griffin 10:33

  I think we have to, because we we lead differently. I think that that is not the norm. And I people listening are probably like, my boss would never do that. They come in and scream at me or bark orders, and that's that, like, that's just, that's just what we expect. I think we have to be able Brene Brown's work around leading with vulnerability is some of the best, I mean, and and

  Molly Bierman 11:00

  tough stuff. I mean that it's not easy to follow that rubric, essentially, like it is hard, like

  Jill Griffin 11:07

  you have to be humble enough to say, Listen, I don't know, I messed up. I made a sneak, right? But if you don't do that, your team is not going to be vulnerable enough to say, Oh, I messed up on that I missed the deadline, or I didn't do what I was supposed to

  Molly Bierman 11:24

  do. Well, I also think what ended up shifting for me too was that I created rapport with some of the management team at that time, and then onward to the next venture and those that worked for me to open up the dialog if you feel like I made a comment or you don't agree with something correct. And there were a lot of people that did step up to that and were comfortable doing that, and so that really kept me in check, right? Because also when you're in leadership, and then we're going to kind of get into we diverted a little bit. But also, when you're in leadership, sometimes you don't really have any supervision, right? Like, depending on where you are exactly on the totem pole here, unless your company is doing 360 reviews, which, at the time, mine wasn't,

  Jill Griffin 12:16

  no one's telling you to do different. No one's telling you to do

  Molly Bierman 12:18

  differently, correct? I think it's a good

  Jill Griffin 12:21

  segue into what we want to talk about today, which is, pain is not punishment. But you could also say discomfort. I mean, that's an uncomfortable moment when you have to own a mistake, right? And in some cases, I think depending on your the way that your brain is situated, and the negative cognitions you carry, like, some of that could be emotional pain, like, totally internalize that whole process of, like, I'm a bad person, good enough, all that stuff. So pain, being emotional pain, even physical pain. And I can talk about my journey with physical pain, but it's information. It's not like we are the ones that assign meaning to that. So talking about normalizing pain, and when you don't normalize in an assigned meaning, it leads to this, I'm sorry. I'm probably gonna piss people off, but this victim mentality, I call it. It's a broke ass mindset, scarcity mindset. It's just I, I call them energy vampires,

  Molly Bierman 13:28

  okay, I like that term.

  Unknown Speaker 13:31

  These are the people

  Molly Bierman 13:33

  who are. They do suck your energy.

  Jill Griffin 13:35

  I'm complaining about everything. Nothing is ever their fault. It's always about everybody else's to blame. They can't do X, Y, Z, A, B, C, because of all of the reasons of the world. I just I don't identify with that.

  Molly Bierman 13:54

  Well, let's break down the definition. So when we define victim mentality, the chronic belief that external forces control your life, ie persistent and harmful, as you consistently see yourself as being wronged by others, minimizing your role in the process, and often see it show up when people are raised in emotionally invalidating environments. Obviously, that links to trauma, which Jill will talk a little bit more about, or have been betrayed. And we're also seeing this a lot in this generation through, you know, social media and, you know, internet bullying and everything else that comes with that, right? So again, the definition that we, you know, identified here for victim mentality, is the chronic belief that external forces control your life, right? And so when I think

  Jill Griffin 14:50

  about social media, though, it's like an echo chamber, yeah, and I noticed this with my own algorithm. I've had to delete accounts, I've had to block accounts, I've had. Accounts, tailor, hide accounts, because what you are consuming leads to what you are going to believe and think about the world, about yourself. And so when I say consume, that's not just what you're putting into your body, alcohol, drugs, water, food like that. Certainly McDonald's difference. McDonald's that changes your mindset, right there, but it's also the TV shows that you're consuming, the social media you're consuming, the the talks that you're having with friends, like what you're allowing into your spirit, right? What you're because if you're in an echo chamber, and I feel like Tiktok algorithm is the worst for this. From what I've heard from clients, friends I've had, I've had people tell me I've had to get off of it because,

  Molly Bierman 15:47

  well, we stand in Unity. Jill and I stand in Unity. We're not on Tiktok,

  Jill Griffin 15:52

  not on Tiktok, not on Tiktok. I will say, though, that that algorithm, it will lead you down this rabbit hole. And I've seen so many young people self diagnose based on the videos that they're watching, latching on to, oh, this is what's wrong with me, because people are just feeding them like, it's not your fault. It's XYZ. This happened to you. So like, you get a pass to, kind of like, have these behaviors, and it's like, you know, a diagnosis is again, information that's not, like, that's not, I don't know, it's not your destiny,

  Molly Bierman 16:28

  yeah, and I think the victim mentality, right? You know, I think a really great way to kind of put what the opposite of victim mentality is, is that you're, you're only in control of your own actions, correct? So the reality is, is that you can be harmed, right? And I think we do need to give a little bit of the disclaimer here

  Jill Griffin 16:47

  about so as a licensed therapist, I have been honored to walk some people through some of the most difficult and challenging things that have happened to them, right? So I want to make a clear distinction that this whole victim mentality that we're talking about, I'm not talking about somebody who's actually been victimized, right, and been a victim of some horrific thing, however, and there's a difference between symptoms of PTSD. So PTSD, I always explain to people is a normal reaction to an abnormal event. So something abnormal happens to you, a sexual assault, a, you know, going to war, a horrific car accident. I mean, I there's plenty of examples, right? But some abnormal event happens, then you have this normal reaction, which typically in terms of the clinical diagnosis of PTSD, is intrusive thoughts, flashbacks, nightmares, severe anxiety. It is a cluster of symptoms that define whether or not you have PTSD. However, I have treated, and I, you know, have experienced this with friends, family members. I people who have been through horrific things in their life, so abnormal events, who have PTSD and do not have a victim mentality. They they do not adhere to, I have no control. It's just they have some of these symptoms that that manifest as this, but they just being in therapy alone is taking control back, right? It's taking control back of like, how do I fix this? What do I have to do to to get past this? So I just want to make that distinction, because I think that there is a difference between having something done to you or going through really hard things, and carrying this victim mentality, there is recovery and healing past something bad happening to you. And I also think normalizing this every person, there are two things that are 1,000% going to happen to you in this lifetime. One is, you're going to die. That's, we haven't seen an instance where that hasn't happened to a human in history. Number two is, you will experience pain. Well, human experience, sure.

  Molly Bierman 19:17

  So, you know, I think how we started off on this topic was, you know, helping, helping us remind ourselves really pain is not punishment. It's information. And it's information to help us say, where do we need to grow? Where do we need to move? What actions do we need to take? So if we're actually aware of it, then we're able to do something about it. I think a lot of times the problem is, is that when someone feels pain, they don't want to feel it right, and when they don't want to feel it, then typically, they engage in behaviors that can be detrimental, harmful, or stunt being able to get on the other side of it right. And so then. Then that kind of catalyst contributes to this victim mentality, where, you know, well, if you had understood, or if you had, you know, whatever, there's a list of excuses of why the individual feels that this has been done to them and not for them, right? And I think a lot of times, some of the things that we experience help us, you know, really, really say, Okay, this, this happened, but I'm really looking at it like this is what was done for me, to move into another space, to move into my next goal, to move into my next, you know, career, or, you know, again, this could be as simple as a job loss, right? It's very easy. You lose your job. And then there's this idea that, you know the job was owed to you. Well, what we don't know about is, you know, the all the decisions going on in the background with that company, and for whatever reason, that wasn't, you know, the right fit, right? Whether that be they were making cuts, whether that means there were layoffs, whether that means you weren't fulfilling your job duties, there's a variety of reasons. And then what happens is that people get stuck consistently

  Jill Griffin 21:14

  thinking meaning in the meaning now, yeah, the meaning of why this happened,

  Molly Bierman 21:18

  right? Right? If they're consistently kind of stuck in that space, like, you know, can you believe my boss fired me and they and, or, you know, laid me off, or whatever it is, and then they constantly kind of stay in that cycle? It really prevents, you and trust me, like we all have experience with this, and I think Jill and I can share some stories about how, you know, we've kind of shifted our mindset. But, you know, you get into these, these holes, essentially, and then you're not able to see all the other opportunities that are basically being thrown at you, right? You don't even see

  Jill Griffin 21:51

  a paradox. No, the paradox, though, is you, you avoid, you think you're avoiding the pain, but you're actually making it worse because long and feel pain, you're feeling shame, guilt, fear, anxiety, whatever the thing is, right? And instead of identifying those and saying, Okay, what do I have control over? And what can I do to change this situation, whether that's internally or externally, like, find a new job in that example, right? But people, there's this paradox of like, well, I'm going to avoid this and shift the blame and poor me and have this broke ass mindset or and I'm still stuck and not fulfilling where I want to be. So like, it is, like, it's expanding the pain. It's not, it's not making it worse. And yes, I think that it's it's one of those things that I thought about this in terms of, like, victim mentality. And when I've been in that space, I will say that drug addicts and alcoholics, I think getting into that you are in a victim mentality, right? And I can say, I will speak for myself, when I look at how that shows up, it shows up as blaming other people or circumstances or institutions, the government, the school, my work, all those things, helplessness, avoidance of responsibility, repeated self sabotage, feeling powerless, seeking pity or validation from others. I'm going to seek out those people that are going to co sign why this is such a terrible thing and why they they can understand why I can't get get out of this situation. Look at look at the situation. It's not my fault. I'm here being hyper vigilant, being defensive when anybody has anything to say in terms of feedback, of a suggestion, to get out of it, and continuing to rehash the situations that reinforce this belief that you are a victim, right? When I was in the thick of it, in active addiction, I met all those criteria, right? And then what it did is it just confirmed my belief that, well, I just have to keep getting high and drinking so that I don't have to think about this, because I wanted to avoid any personal responsibility that I had to get out of that situation. And this is where I think 12 step, 12 step groups really do. Point it back to, what's your part in this? What Where did you have responsibility in this to get you here? Because if I allow somebody to mistreat me over and over and over and over, am I a victim of that mistreatment? Yes. However, if I just, if I continue to show up in the in this situation and expect it to be different, that's insanity, first of all, and second of all, my part is I continue to allow it to happen, right? And I know there's nuances and all this, and this is going to piss people off, and everyone has a different circumstances. I'm not saying that everybody's choices are the same in every in every instance that they are a victim. However, there are always. Choices available. And I will say that the people are not always

  Molly Bierman 25:03

  easy. Well, I think that the people it will upset are likely the people that are kind of still stuck in that process, right? One so, you know, I can understand that, right? Like there wasn't always a time where we were open and saying, you know, pain is the catalyst for the next opportunity, right? Like that that

  Jill Griffin 25:27

  we still don't, that's still always not the first right in space. Like right, sometimes you need a little second to be in a pity I mean, I know I've texted you or I've said to other friends, like, I'm just letting you know where I'm at right now, and I'm gonna enjoy I'm in a pity party right now, and I know that's where I'm at, and I'm gonna stay there for a little bit, and I don't want feedback, you know, and I'm not gonna hear it. I'm gonna be in a little pity party right now, but I don't stay there. That's the difference.

  Molly Bierman 25:52

  Well, you don't stay there. But also, there's accountability. So right, when we think about pain is not a punishment, and it's a growth opportunity, or it's a challenge, or it's a, you know,

  Jill Griffin 26:05

  it's information. What do I need to do with this? Yeah, sometimes it's making a really hard decision, and sometimes it's exhausting. I just saw, um, I don't know if you've listened at all to Amy pullers podcast yet, but I saw this clip of her, and she was talking about, like, I'm done giving 100% like, I'm out here giving 25% sometimes 75% but like, I'm done giving 100% like, it's exhausting to just always have to be better. And that is part of this is like, sometimes when we're in pain, and I can share my experience with this, but sometimes when we're in pain, whether that's emotional or physical, sometimes my reaction is like, God, I didn't need another thing to work on right now. Yes. Like, I was good coasting. I didn't want to work on another thing right now. And sometimes that thing has to be shelved for a minute. Like, I don't have the emotional capacity for this. But sometimes, like, I mean, I've had experiences with physical pain. I couldn't put off dealing with that. I had to deal with it. Well, what do

  Molly Bierman 27:07

  you feel like the face down moments for you were when you were in pain, it was you maybe sat in the pity party for a period of time, and then, like, what was the come up after that? So

  Jill Griffin 27:24

  just for a little bit of backstory, I have a long history of physical pain in my story from before I got and that was part of why I started with my addiction was because of physical pain in terms of the whole opiates, and then, you know, when I got sober, I had herniated discs in my lower back. I've had full ankle reconstruction surgery. I've had my neck is a chronic mess. I mean, I have, if you look at the scans of my neck, I probably shouldn't be doing most the doctors will tell me, like, basically, you'll need neck surgery, right? I have arthritis, I have slipped discs. I have all this stuff from whiplash, from honestly, a lot of it is how I live my life throughout the years, until I started taking care of myself. Well,

  Molly Bierman 28:13

  I think pause there right for a second. Like, what you're saying is I'm in pain by my choices. You know, some

  Jill Griffin 28:22

  of it was by my choices, for sure. Yeah, yeah, okay. You know, my first ankle reconstruction surgery, I was 17, so I was, like, on, you know, I was on limited time with my ankle before it was gonna, like, give out again, essentially. And now I have metal in there, and it's good, but, like, I remember the ankle thing. It was like, I kind of moved into acceptance really quickly, because I knew when I trashed my ankle. I remember looking at my husband and being like, I'm gonna need surgery. He's like, Oh, well, let's try to stay positive. Maybe it's just no, this is done. We are done. Here. We are getting surgery. Like, that's where this ends. And I was correct. It was the ankle just gave out. It's decided it wasn't going to work anymore, and I couldn't remember sitting there in pain afterwards. I mean, I got super depressed. I think that that experience, it wasn't necessarily a victim mentality of like, why is this happening to me? Because we knew, I knew that this was going to happen at some point I was going to need this ankle corrected. But I did. I mean, I remember being in my cast, in my boot, I would be there doing arm workouts. I tried to do everything I could do within my power, which was very limited. And I think listening to that pain of like, and I kind of just accepted this was God's way of like, having me slow down a little bit, and really recognizing how uncomfortable I was in that rest. And that's what I think transformed my ability to slow down and to rest, and how. Important that is because I was used to just going, going going, and ignoring maybe some of the things that I needed to be listening to internally. But when you're going going going, you can't do

  Molly Bierman 30:11

  that. Yeah, absolutely well,

  Jill Griffin 30:14

  and when the next, when the next thing happened that I remember being like, Nope, I wouldn't even allow myself to go there one, because I was scared to go back into that, like, depressed mindset, because that's not like, normally how I am. And I was like, that was too scary. I didn't even realize I was depressed until I wasn't anymore, which I think is something that people can identify with, like, you don't realize how bad it was until you're out of it. And I was like, There's no way I'm going back there. And I remember a couple people reflecting back to me. I mean, when I tell you, I was in level 10 pain with my neck. I could not lift my arm past right here, my husband had to help me get dressed in the morning. I could not lift my arm because my neck was so messed up, and I was going to all these really painful, like PT appointments and all this stuff to try to, like, move it and get it better. And I would cry. I mean, it was, it was so pain. And when your neck hurts, like you can't think clearly, like your whole body hurts. I mean, it's the whole thing. Was just like, Yeah, but I remember thinking, I am going to do whatever it takes to not be in this pain. And I followed through with that. And when I tell you that that was not an easy season. I mean, that was a year and a half of doctors, hospital visits, panic attacks. I mean, I've never had a panic attack in my life, and I was in denial that I was having a panic attack for a year and a half, just so everyone is clear. As a licensed therapist, I was very convinced that this was not anxiety, yeah, some medical I thought something was wrong on my heart, yes, but I think that's why it's so hard for me to to really understand people with a victim mentality, because it's like and I think you can identify with this. I've walked through so many hard fucking things, yeah, really hard fucking things. And not only have I survived them, but I've thrived after them, and I don't let any of that be an excuse of why I can't show up as as somebody today with control over my life and my behavior and my actions.

  Molly Bierman 32:22

  Well, I think that that kind of goes back to an earlier episode when we talked about the risk, right? There's a lot of people that are ambivalent to take the risk, and so part of when you're in the pain and you're in the face down moment is in order to not slip into that victim mentality, you have to take risk. The next step you take is a risk. So after you had the physical pain, the surgery, the challenges around that, you had to say, I'm going to step back into the gym, right? That was probably scary. I would assume you needed to step back into your day to day life. You needed to build up your stamina stamina. You needed to be there for your kids, right? All of these things started to shift. And the longer that you kind of moved out of the physical pain, you had more data that the pain was actually not a punishment and it was an opportunity, because I'll be here to remind you that after that whole season, that year and a half, you on the you coming out of that, I mean, you did so many things. I mean, in my mind, you're an Olympic athlete, okay, in my mind, you're an Olympic athlete. I see your Instagram and I'm like, I am going to do one set up now, okay, and Jill has basically run a marathon. So your athletic, your I mean, your athletic capability, your ability to build a business. You know, multiple businesses, scaling. You know, evolution in your marriage, evolution with your children, right? Like all these things and so, you know, I think I kind of compare it to my time when I was given the news that the company that I had been building for five years was going to sell, right? We were

  Jill Griffin 34:18

  going through it at the same time. To be clear, this was, we were just trading fear stories, securities. We're like, we're we're just trudging along here.

  Molly Bierman 34:30

  I like how you're out of breath when you're saying that, because that's really what it felt like. And another thing, yeah, and I have, like, you know, goosebumps really like even talking about it because, and if you're not in tune with, like, goosebumps don't just happen because they happen. Like, there's a reason your body's like, you know, telling you something that's just a little kind of side note, at least for me, and so when I just said that about, you know, that that hard time, my body's like, oh, yeah, that was painful, right? Like, I could feel it, you know? Remembering what that challenge looked like. And really, you know, there was a lot of blame. There was a lot of blame. There was a lot of me avoiding hard conversations. There was a lot of me feeling powerless over, you know, the outcome. There was a lot of me trying to exert my power to make it less painful. I mean, I tried it all right, and so I did stay in those I still kept going. But it didn't mean that it was pretty right. It didn't mean that parts and parts of me were really struggling, you know, well, lots of tears, oh,

  Jill Griffin 35:36

  you have to have somebody that you're gonna say, say the thing to and they're going to reflect back, okay, I hear you now. What are you going to do about it?

  Molly Bierman 35:46

  Now? What I know, but sometimes when people would say that to me, I wanted to be like, Go yourself. I

  Jill Griffin 35:51

  know. But then, but at some point, something shifted. I think when you yes that risk just now, though, what came up for me, the biggest risk I took during that wasn't even entering back on the other side of it. It was honestly and you're one of these people. I had like three or four people that really knew what was going on with me, because I didn't want to just spill this again. It goes back to rehashing situations to make yourself feel like a victim. You need to have these people in your life that you know are safe to go to, that are going to hold space for you and hold you accountable to what you're what you need to do to get better. Yeah, and those things are sometimes hard and uncomfortable, and the things that people say that you're going to want to be like, Fuck you, but those three or four people, the riskiest thing and the most vulnerable thing I had to do is day after day, sometimes multiple times a day, me just vomiting all of the stuff onto those people of like, today sucks. I'm in so much pain. I'm sitting here crying. I don't know how I'm even gonna get up to feed the kids dinner like I don't, I can barely function. I like, and having to tell people like, I'm not okay, over and over and over again for a year and a half, like, and I think what happens with some people is they isolate themselves where they're like, well, these they don't want to hear it again. They don't want to hear that. I'm still going through this. They don't want to hear and it's like I had to get that out, or else I was going to internalize it and start feeling really bad for myself

  Molly Bierman 37:25

  well. And you did say, you would say that you would say there would be a disclaimer. I know you're sick of hearing me talk about this and then you but it's true, like I had to, but I think too that if you're in a place where you have stability and you feel grounded, obviously you're, you know, this kind of goes back into, you know, the episode with Nikki Spoelstra, you know, if you're being of service, that might be my role in the friendship at that point in time, right, is to just be of service and to be able to listen and not to problem solve, listen. That's hard for me, and there's a lot of people in my life that know that, because I'm really quick to give you solution, and a lot of times individuals don't necessarily want a solution. So again, I think it's a balancing act. I think

  Jill Griffin 38:11

  that time in my life, no one had a solution for me. They were like, Girl, you're going through it. Like,

  Molly Bierman 38:18

  yeah. But the pain, the pain piece, is like, sometimes we just have to let the person be in pain, right? We just need to acknowledge that they're in pain. And that's the whether that's physical pain, emotional pain, spiritual pain.

  Jill Griffin 38:29

  The most helpful thing was, like, that sucks, but it sounds like you're doing everything you can to get out of it, like, but I think that has to be genuine, like, it's the safe option to stay in that mentality and have the people like, Oh yeah, that that sounds that sounds really bad, that sounds like really bad and Okay. Like, just validating the experience. Like, validation in itself isn't enough. What is the action? What are we doing? There has to be an action on the other side of it. Yeah,

  Molly Bierman 39:06

  yeah. But a lot of people feel paralyzed by that kind of it goes back to the risk. So when we think about, you know, what actions can we take? It's pretty simple for me, at least, right? You know, I'll kind of take it pretty granular. For me, it's movement, right? I need to just move my body in some way to kind of, how is you this through? Yeah, just I feeling stuck, feeling overwhelmed, feeling like I'm stuck in a pain point, right? Whatever it is, there's a million things that go on in life on any given day, right? And that's like our own nuclear lives. Then you look out into the world and you're like, Okay, I'll go back to my you know, I'll go back to my life. And I think that's also something that we learned early on. There's this kind of old saying that we grew up in recovery hearing, which is, everyone puts their problems in the middle of the table. You're going to be quick to. Take yours back, right? 1,000% so when we're feeling like we're in that, that pain point, sometimes I need to, it's not that I need to compare, but I need to remind myself that I don't really want anyone else's problems either, right? So everyone has them, and it's up to me to really take the action to move through that pain. And sometimes that means, you know, yes, physical movement. Sometimes that means looking for a new opportunity. Sometimes that means really getting the lesson out of the pain point right. Like, I mean, that was a big one for me. While we started to move towards the acquisition of the center that I was running. There was a lot of pain through the transition, because new owners were coming in. Their expectations were were changing. The program was changing. Things were evolving at a rapid speed. And I remember walking away from that experience and saying, I could have listened. I could have bucked back. I could have made excuses. I could have really dug my heels in. I did dig my heels in here and there. You know, when I was in fear, and I'd have to go back and say, you know, I'm sorry I'm digging my heels in on this. I can see why this, you know, shift needs to happen, or this transition needs to happen. And by the end of that time, there was a lot of people that would come to me and be like, how was it? Seemed like it was really overwhelming. Seemed like it was really daunting. What I'll tell you about it, and I think we've talked a lot about it, was that it really gave me perspective and actually strengthened my skillset in ways that I kind of didn't think were possible, right, like, it squeezed me pretty hard, and I was still able to come to a place where the pain still felt like it was worth the reward. And some people think I'm a little crazy about it, right? Like, there's some individuals who think, like, come on Molly. Like, be serious. There was, like, a couple weeks ago, somebody called me and was kind of venting, and we were talking about the transition, you know, of me leaving that organization and starting anew, and you know me kind of highlighting the you know, transition and then and the wins that I had through that process, and it was almost like they kind of wanted to put it down, and they and they wanted to say, like, you're kind of sugar coating it. But the reality was, I wasn't right my perception of that time and that challenge. Firstly, I wouldn't be in the place that I am today. Number one, I wouldn't have the flexibility that I have in my life now and kids became really important. You know, obviously, as I had my kids, you know, my priorities shifted as they get older, of like, how much time I have available to them, but even more so that it really squeezed on the parts that I felt like I couldn't accomplish, and I walked out of there with a new skill set and a new perspective, and it catapulted me into the next phase, right? So that's what

  Jill Griffin 43:07

  you just said, too about my experience. And I think that's a really important distinction between somebody with a scarcity or victim mentality and victim mindset and somebody with a growth mindset, people with growth mindsets and successful people. I don't care who you use as an example of success, whether that's us, whether that's some celebrity, whether that's every one of them has gone through something very difficult, but that difficult time, that pain, is a portal into your next level. That's how you level up in life. It's kind of like the example of like diamonds are built through friction. And I don't know exactly, but it's something to do with like, they get pushed really hard, right? There's something, there's something, there's something with a diamond, a diamond, diamonds are the strongest material. No, no, they don't get crushed. But there's like so much pressure that makes the diamonds fact check me, but I'm pretty sure that's what it is. But the whole point of what I'm trying to say is you have to be in that pressure cooker experience, or the go through that really hard thing to come out on the other side with that changed perspective that what's next for me now I have, now I have intense heat

  Molly Bierman 44:27

  and pressure. You are right. Diamonds were formed over 3 billion years ago, deep within the Earth's crust under conditions of intense heat and pressure that cause carbon atoms.

  Jill Griffin 44:36

  So when those things happen, I almost get excited now, like I had to remind myself this week, having this really tough week, all this expansion, all these things, I'm in that pressure cooker now, it's like, Dude, I can't even I can't even imagine what's next for me. I can't but that came over time of me getting through these really hard things, and somebody said something to me really early in my recovery. Story. I've talked about this before, when I couldn't find a job. I'm a convicted felon. I have no job experience for years. At this point, I cannot get a job. I'm dealing with a with client dealing with this right now. You know, well, no one's hiring. It's like, well, there's, there's two things you can do is say no one's hiring, and poor me and I can't get a job, and a list of reasons of why this thing can't happen, or I'm going to do whatever it takes to get this job. And for me, I had to go, and I had to go ask for help, right? And I remember somebody saying to me, God, opens doors that no man can close. And that shifted my perspective enough to be like, this is supernatural. At this point, there is going to be an opportunity that comes to me. I have to do the work, though. It's not like I just get to sit back on my couch and be like, well, doors are gonna open for me. No, I had to go out there and hustle. I had to go out on interviews. I ended up going to a job specialist, which is a very humbling experience, but I knew at that point I need help getting this job. Somebody's going to have a coach is going to facilitate me getting a job somehow, which that catapulted me to the next level. But like, the difference is you can look at all the reasons why something won't happen, or you can look at all have the audacity and the delusion to be like, well, I'm going to do it anyway, because, you know what? There are so many examples in history and in life, and this is why I think reading is so important. I think listening to podcasts, I think hearing about other people's experiences are so important because it gives you a framework that you can't imagine yourself for yourself that other people have done this really unimaginable thing and this really audacious thing, and they've gone out and had this unbelievable belief in themselves, and they've done it anyway. Well, I also

  Molly Bierman 46:51

  think too sometimes when we're going through pain, it's not necessarily the event that you think is right in front of you too, right like there is this idea that the pain may be being created because it's pushing you in some other direction, right? And something else in your life maybe isn't aligning, right? So I think really looking at, rather than being situated on the event, you know, because for me, during that time, I was situated on the event, you know, this is going to happen. This is how it's going to impact, you know, X, Y and Z. This is how it's going to impact me. This is how it's going to impact others. But really what I needed to do, and what I found myself is, once the emotion started to die down, I could really look at it objectively and say, okay, and and then there's all these reasons of why it does need to take this next step, right? So, I, you know, I think my, my recommendation, you know, for people, is to really look at, try to zoom out a little bit, you know, don't be so hyper focused on the exact event, right? The surgery, the challenge, the job loss, like if, if we can zoom out a little bit and really look at maybe a few circles away from our immediate ether in that moment, it really gives a little bit of context and perspective of what's trying to be shown to you. You know, well, pain supposed to happen next.

  Jill Griffin 48:19

  You need to look at pain, revealing for you and reflecting back to yourself. Okay, what, what do I need to heal here? Where do I need some different boundaries, or what do I need to change, and what action do I need to take? When you said that about surgery, what popped in my head and I don't I think I talked to you about this when I had that surgery, what came up for me was some unhealed stuff from my surgery when I was 17. Yeah, because when I was 17, I was a varsity athlete, I, you know, and I had this injury that lingered, and there was some question about, was I really injured, or did I was I just kind of, like faking, faking this injury so I didn't have to play? Was I trying to get out of playing sports? Yeah, and I was also grappling, as a 17 year old with like, I'm now a disappointment because I'm not fulfilling my my job on these varsity teams. And you know, this big, there was a big loss, right of sports in my life, because I was injured and then had to get a surgery that really ramped up my substance use at an early age. But like when I sat down, you know, when you get quiet, what gets loud? Because when you have to sit down and really think about like and I was sitting down a lot when I was recovering from that surgery. I remember, and I remember those thoughts of my 17 year old self came up a lot, and that was something that I had to heal and work through and journal about and talk about. And to some people, it probably seems so disconnected, but that's how trauma works. Yeah, and for me, I see this victim mentality happen a lot. And you know, EMDR is such a great modality to get to this subconscious. Because I think talk therapy, my experience is I can't get to some of these things, because people are so logical a lot of times, or they're stuck in their emotions and they can't get to the to the logic piece or but EMDR, brings together what you're feeling in your body, what you're thinking about, and what you're feeling, and you're a lot, it kind of gets you into a space to go into those deep down moments of like, Oh, I see it a lot in attachment trauma, people that grew up with parents who were emotionally invalidating didn't give them the emotional support that they needed. And it doesn't mean you didn't have a good childhood. It just means you didn't get everything you needed as a child, but it leads to things like, I'm not good enough. Yeah, I'm a disappointment. All these underlying negative beliefs about yourself that you don't even know you have, and they are driving your behavior throughout life,

  Molly Bierman 51:03

  yeah, and driving the victim mentality. But I think that there's subtle shifts. You know, a lot of what we kind of outlined is the language shifts, right? Rather than talking about, you talk about, I, why is this happening to me? Let's shift it to what? What is this trying to show me they made me feel this way, instead of saying I feel this way, right? So I think that once those language shifts starts to happen, it really kind of puts it back into your own individual arena. And I think going back to what I originally said at the beginning of this episode, which is, I am only responsible for my own actions. I do not have control. I do not have control over my kids. I know people may think that's crazy, but the reality is is I can create framework. I can create scaffolding, but at the end of the day, those kids are gonna make some healthy and unhealthy decisions independently of what I think about it,

  Jill Griffin 52:05

  right, 1,000%

  Molly Bierman 52:08

  so, you know, I think this also kind of ties into the families that we work with, right? I mean, my whole, my whole business is, you know, created and stands on the principle that the family system needs to be looked at as a whole, rather than, Oh, it's just what Joe did, or just what Dan did or just what mom did, right? No, everybody plays a part in the system. And how did we get there, right? And how we typically get there is, how are we gonna get out? There's some level of crisis that occurred, some level of breakdown in communication, some level of a need not being met, and then everybody fell into their cert it fell into their certain roles, and created their narratives and their allegiance with different individuals in the system, right? And so what I really help individuals try to shift is, how do we start to communicate in a way that's taking responsibility for the only thing we have, responsible for our actions and our boundaries. You know pain can you know pain can exist, but actions are really going to be where the rubber meets the

  Jill Griffin 53:21

  road. Well, let's talk about the actions. So getting out of this victim mentality, if you're listening to this and you're like, Whoa, there's some things I need to shift. Or even if there's people in your life that those energy vampires or those people, I mean, I also think it's surrounding yourself with the people that are gonna hold you, the habitability.

  Molly Bierman 53:45

  I mean, I think basic implementation, super basic

  Jill Griffin 53:50

  practicing gratitude, a gratitude list. I mean, that is just we do it, that we do it

  Molly Bierman 53:56

  every day. We do it every day. So we're not we're not asking you to do things that you that we're not doing and sometimes doing that, I'm going to tell you,

  Jill Griffin 54:04

  sometimes the things on my gratitude list are coffee. Okay, there are some fun. There are some ungrateful times that I don't want to do.

  Molly Bierman 54:17

  Hopefully they're not bad today, I mean. And by bad I mean, okay, gratitude. Today we do five things, guys. Okay, so mine today was workout, which I did post McDonald's, okay, just for the for the listeners, time in the sauna, quiet moments, work, feeling more organized, and my podcast recording today,

  Jill Griffin 54:42

  you're up. My gratitude was recording today, going out to lunch with my team later. Yes, my husband helping out in the mornings, because I've not, Yep, I've not been there this in the mornings.

  Molly Bierman 55:00

  This week, I should probably also say that. So ditto for our husbands, because Sam really does come through Okay.

  Jill Griffin 55:07

  Number four, I got through the day yesterday, even though I was completely scattered, hot mess Express yesterday, but I survived. It was a new day today, so it's fine. And in the renovation, our office space is almost complete and completely furnished, but like, sometimes the gratitude is so basic. It's like, I had a warm place to sleep last night. Like, I think sometimes we're like, well, nothing in my life is going right. It's like, but did you have food to eat today? Did you have a warm place to say? Do you have one person that that loves you? Like, I'm sorry, but there are people in this life that don't have those three things that I just mentioned Exactly, exactly. So

  Molly Bierman 55:46

  we go through and if you can't do five, you try to do one.

  Unknown Speaker 55:49

  Yeah, right.

  Molly Bierman 55:51

  Like, and there are some days where I'm I am really hitting a wall. So take an inventory of your part or behavior, feeling or action. I mean, we all taking an inventory. Yeah, we do do this every day. But I also would say that taking an inventory of your parts, sometimes you need assistance doing that, so be open to feedback. You know, I think, I think this is where journaling, this is where journaling,

  Jill Griffin 56:16

  though, it's just dumping it all like, dump all the blame, dump all the things and then shift it towards Okay, read that back. What's my part in all those things that I'm blaming? Yeah, take your control back.

  Molly Bierman 56:30

  Change your inner dialog.

  Jill Griffin 56:33

  I think that's where you shift some of the language you're using. Like you first you have to notice the inner dialog. If your inner dialog is negative, negative, negative. This won't work because of this. Okay, so let's list three reasons how it can work. Yes, if it's always you know you're you're making me feel this way, how I feel this way. Yes, like it's small, subtle shifts, but you first have to recognize you what your own inner talk is like. Yes,

  Molly Bierman 57:03

  practice kindness and compassion with yourself. I mean, look, doing something nice for yourself, being able to give yourself grace, being able to say, like, I'm not going to be able to meet that requirement today and be okay with it, right? So again, I think a lot of times, you know? What really helped catapult that for me, especially when I would start in these new roles, or a new job change or a new business, that I would beat myself up, that everything needed to look a certain way, you know. And the more people point out, like, take it easy on yourself, the more I don't know, the more room there is to relish in the accomplishment, but also be aware of the, you know, the stuck points.

  Jill Griffin 57:50

  I also think practicing kindness and compassion is just, you know, to me, it just always goes that back down to like slowing down and like doing, like, put on a face of makeup, even if you have nowhere to go, dress nicely when you're going out somewhere. Like taking care of your physical body, like doing a workout, going on a walk, like being kind to your body, like, in a way where, again, going back to, like, that self sabotaging is like the opposite. How can I take care of myself today? That feels really good, yes. Whether that's a bath, a nice shower, putting a bath bomb in your bath, like, just things that seem like, well, how is this gonna shift anything it's like, because it kind of just shows your brain, like, I'm being nice to myself, instead of this internal like, I don't know, we take the bat out and we just beat ourselves up sometimes, like, I remember in those moments when I was in pain, if you ha are going through a really tough time, you need to take things off your plate and be okay. If, okay, well, I can't cook dinner tonight. We're ordering out today, and that's okay.

  Molly Bierman 58:51

  Yeah, I still beat myself up about stuff like that. I'll be like, Yeah, I should do that. And then, you know, but again, I think that's like, these are opportunities to really say, Okay, this is somewhere where I'm falling short choosing curiosity or shame. I mean, there is, you know, such a thing as saying, like, staying curious rather than staying judgmental, stay

  Jill Griffin 59:18

  so you know what I learned here? You know, what I learned, though, is the same part of your brain that creates and experiences anxiety is also the same part of your brain that that experiences curiosity.

  Speaker 1 59:34

  So interesting, if you say curious,

  Jill Griffin 59:37

  and this curiosity and what, and what we mean by that is asking questions. So those questions around like, you know, what is this? Trying to show me what information is this pain, trying to being curious about like, how do I feel? You know, just asking these questions, it actually is impossible to hold both things at the same time. So curiosity is really. The antidote to this like, anxious feeling of like, which I feel like, happens when you're stuck. You feel anxious because it's an energy that has to move. There's something absolutely so this curiosity and asking these questions can really be the antidote to that anxious feeling that you're having, yeah,

  Molly Bierman 1:00:18

  and setting boundaries with yourself, right and others. So there is this way to kind of keep yourself accountable. And if you feel like you're kind of stuck in the victim mentality around any one event or certain series of your life, maybe there needs to be some level of accountability with another person who maybe, if they feel

  Unknown Speaker 1:00:39

  Yeah, maybe,

  Molly Bierman 1:00:41

  yeah, therapy would be a good start. But also, you know, but I think also that there are, you know, if you open up the dialog to some friendships that are maybe taking strides and not in that mentality, or you admire them, right? Because I think a lot of times, you know, you also look at individuals and you admire that they don't get stuck there, right? So

  Jill Griffin 1:01:01

  get somebody, somebody in that victim mentality, though, you have to be willing to receive feedback you have if you're going to ask to be accountable and you're gonna You also, because somebody who's in that victim mentality will get very defensive around any anything that presses up against that narrative that they are tightly holding

  Molly Bierman 1:01:22

  on to, yes. And

  Jill Griffin 1:01:27

  so if you're in the thick it can be broken, yeah. So if you're, if you're in the thick of it, this is not about toxic positivity. This isn't about like you're going through really something, really shitty, and you're gonna say, like, Oh, I'm fine. I'm just, I'm just so grateful. And these are my gratitude No, like, you're allowed to say, this sucks, and these are the things that I'm still grateful for, even though I'm going through this really shitty time. Like, yes, there is an and you can be going through a hard time and hold gratitude. You can be going through a hard time and still have hope that you're going to get through the to the other side, like it's not one or the other. So it's not about like faking it. And you don't need to be over something to change your mindset. You could be in the thick of it, and you can start being curious and start shifting some of these things. It's a process. It's not either or. We're not in black and white thinking, here we are. We are in the and

  Molly Bierman 1:02:24

  yeah, and start with something small, safe choices that reinforce your agency really help you to kind of take strides to build more confidence around it. And then, you know, this is just like a really large PSA, which is, you aren't broken. Pain is not evidence of failure, and it's part of the process, you know. So with that, I'm gonna let Jill do our permission slip for today,

  Jill Griffin 1:02:55

  the permission slip today,

  Molly Bierman 1:02:57

  I hope you use the one that I think you're gonna

  Jill Griffin 1:03:01

  use is to challenge yourself to notice one place in your life where you are waiting to be rescued. I No one is coming to save you. We've said this before. I will say it again. You need to rescue yourself, and so I really am going to invite you and give you permission to be curious around those things, asking yourself what it looks like if I choose myself, and I choose to rescue myself in this situation, pain is not punishment. It's a portal to your next level. So if you're in the thick of it right now and you're feeling some pain points, things are going to get really awesome on the other side, if you make some of these, some of the right choices, but you have to alchemize that pain into something else. Yeah, that's my permission slip.

  Molly Bierman 1:03:55

  Excellent. Permission slip. Pain is not punishment, flipping the script on victim mentality. Thanks for listening.