Season 2 Episode 9 with Jill Griffin & Molly Bierman
Does being authentic mean sharing every detail of your life? And is keeping something to yourself the same as keeping a secret?
In this episode of No Permission Necessary, Jill Griffin and Molly Bierman explore the difference between privacy and secrecy, the pressure to overshare, and the importance of creating boundaries around personal information.
Through personal stories about recovery, career changes, business decisions, friendship dynamics, grief, and health, Jill and Molly discuss why some experiences need room to develop before they're shared with others.
They also explore how social media can blur the line between authenticity and unlimited access, how outside opinions influence self-trust, and why protecting your personal life doesn't automatically mean hiding something.
The conversation offers a thoughtful look at when privacy is protective, when secrecy may be connected to shame, and how to decide who gets access to the parts of your story that matter most.
Because you're allowed to be honest without making your entire life available for public discussion.
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Jill Griffin (00:00)
a
difference between secret and private. And so I I
Molly Bierman (00:02)
Mm.
Jill Griffin (00:03)
it's important to make that distinction. Secret to me is associated a little bit more with shame.
Molly Bierman (00:10)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (00:11)
And I think that being private, there's something sacred about keeping some things to yourself.
If you're keeping secrets, does somebody know, am I keeping this or is it keeping me?
we're talking about something. I don't know. May I don't know if taboo's the right word, but permission to keep something to yourself.
Molly Bierman (00:41)
Ooh.
Jill Griffin (00:42)
And so I'm wondering if there is
a time that maybe you shared something too soon and regretted it, or maybe someone felt like they were entitled to part of your story.
I think we can all agree that just because you didn't post it or tell everybody about it doesn't also mean that you're hiding something either.
Molly Bierman (01:01)
I mean, this is a big part of the learning curve that I've had in my life. I think there was many years that I would go through life with like shouting from the hilltop, right? Mainly
Jill Griffin (01:13)
Mm.
Molly Bierman (01:14)
around me getting sober, which was a failed attempt. Failed attempt a couple
Jill Griffin (01:16)
I wanted everyone to know. Everyone to know.
Molly Bierman (01:19)
of times. So like we needed to kind of dial it back.
Jill Griffin (01:23)
You know
what's a jump scare is all the times that I when you go to your like Facebook memories and they show up, the jump scare for me is how many times I shared publicly that I quit smoking cigarettes.
Or nicotine and and how that didn't stick. But I think maybe shouting everything from the rooftops, I think sometimes we feel like it's an accountability thing too.
Molly Bierman (01:44)
I do think it's an accountability thing, but I will say that there is some creativity in being quiet, right? So allowing yourself to have your own process and be able to tease out, I think I've done that a lot more now. Like if I have an idea and I'm thinking about an idea, it's gonna percolate for a bit before I go and like execute that decision. And not necessarily most people would look at me like, I
say exactly what I mean. I mean what I say pretty pretty regularly, right? But in terms of not having the whole thing figured out, or close to the way there, I feel like I am a little bit more reserved now because I I also feel like not everybody needs to know what's going on. I don't know.
Jill Griffin (02:29)
a
difference between secret and private. And so I I
Molly Bierman (02:32)
Mm.
Jill Griffin (02:33)
it's important to make that distinction. Secret to me is associated a little bit more with shame.
Molly Bierman (02:39)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (02:40)
And I think that being private, there's something sacred about keeping some things to yourself.
And really being ready to share that with the world. The example that comes up for me is as a woman and just my journey is around pregnancy. I remember being really private around what I was gonna name my children.
And
Molly Bierman (03:01)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (03:03)
also like the
Having that private time where just my husband and I knew about it, like before telling anybody, like I feel like that was like a special sacred time where it was like I didn't want to not share it with people, but like it was nice to just have it just between us for a little while.
Molly Bierman (03:20)
I 100% agree with that. And and I do think that, you know, my biggest takeaway from kind of keeping something.
private was the next move I was going to make. in my career. Like there was a lot of conversations over the course of an extended period of time. And there were like only a handful of people I was sharing with because I really wanted to make sure that this is what I wanted. I think that the key to keeping things private or keeping them in an intimate group is that you're not
Going out and seeking a bunch of opinion.
Jill Griffin (03:53)
Yeah, the distinction to me is also we've built our careers on honesty. I mean, not
Molly Bierman (03:59)
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (04:00)
just that, but our lives. Like I think we are people who really want to be genuine, authentic. but my authenticity doesn't mean that I'm an open book to everybody either. And so I think for me, the there is a pressure with social media.
And also because we've opened ourselves up a little bit more, people feel like they're entitled to know the details and all and and get like a seat at the table and have an opinion sometimes. And that's where I think the privacy line comes in, where it's like, yeah, one, I don't want everybody's opinion on decisions I'm making. There might be a time where I pull or I'm looking for that, but most often in my life now, sometimes I don't care at all what other people think.
Depending on what it is.
Molly Bierman (04:42)
Right. Right.
Jill Griffin (04:44)
Other times it's like really the only people that get a vote here are the ones closest to me because it may affect them.
Molly Bierman (04:49)
Yeah. Yeah.
Jill Griffin (04:52)
I've really, I actually wrote something about this on Substack recently that reminded me of this topic where I just feel I felt this pull to just like back away from so many, like just kind of like go into a turtle shell.
and
And part of it, which which seems probably ironic because I've actually been sharing more on social media. I've actually been like a little bit more like public facing with like maybe some things that are going on. But that's only like a part of what's going on. It's like the iceberg, right? I have all this other stuff underneath the surface
that's
Molly Bierman (05:24)
Right.
Jill Griffin (05:24)
happening that like really I'm just kind of mulling over. I'm figuring out. I'm not really outwardly talking about it. And what I will say is.
Creativity is one word for it, but it like just gives me more time to really crystallize what I actually want to be doing and why. I don't know.
Molly Bierman (05:43)
Yeah, I mean, look, I I kind of take it to another, you know, another level, which is old school saying, I think, which is prayer is talking to the universe, God, whatever you believe in, and meditation is listening. So when we're really quiet, we're able to
Hear the message, hear the clarity, right? So That privacy is really what causes us to be able to deliver on the next thing or
whatever it is, you know.
Jill Griffin (06:08)
The other side of that is the secrecy.
If you're keeping secrets, does somebody know, am I keeping this or is it keeping me?
And what I mean by that is, is it keeping me up at night? Am I getting stomach aches? Am
Molly Bierman (06:20)
Right. Right.
Jill Griffin (06:22)
I is my mental health suffering because I'm holding on to this? And if it came out, would I be relieved or would I feel exposed? Because I feel like, again, going back to secrets equal shame. And in our world, secrets, you're only as sick as the secrets you keep, right?
Molly Bierman (06:38)
Right.
Jill Griffin (06:38)
And and to me, in my recovery journey in my life as a therapist, the times that I have been a witness to somebody saying something out loud to me for the first time, right? That they've never told anyone else this thing. I'm the
Molly Bierman (06:51)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (06:52)
only one, I'm the first one. I might be the only one for the rest of their life that knows about this thing.
Molly Bierman (06:56)
Right.
Jill Griffin (06:57)
It is such an honor to be in the room when that happens because it is like a deflate like a balloon that deflates. Like the relief that comes from that.
Molly Bierman (07:06)
my gosh. Totally. I just experienced that this week with a client.
it's powerful. So I think that, you know, that kind of comes into our three question test, which I think has been something that I've I've definitely used. Does at least one person know? Am I keeping this or is it keeping me?
Very good question. And if I came out, would I feel exposed or would I feel relieved? I think that for that, I always want to make sure I have one person who knows where I'm at, right? So whether that's my husband, whether that's a friend, whether that's a sponsor, whatever that looks like, mentor.
Jill Griffin (07:43)
Yep.
Molly Bierman (07:43)
Am I keeping this or is it keeping me?
You know, it's interesting because we have this question on our inventory when you're in recovery, which is like, is there something you need to self that you need to tell somebody else? Right.
Jill Griffin (07:50)
Is there something you're keeping to yourself that you need to tell somebody? Like, is there something yeah.
Molly Bierman (07:56)
Right. So it's this constant reminder. Is there anything that is weighing me down? And also, would I feel relieved or would I feel exposed? I mean
I don't really remember the last time I felt exposed by saying something. Exposed feels like
Jill Griffin (08:09)
Shame. Feels like naked. It feels like you're naked and you have nothing, no defense against that. Like I
Molly Bierman (08:11)
Yeah, I guess. Sure. Right.
Jill Griffin (08:16)
I mean, I think that there are things that you're allowed to keep and it makes sense. So a goal before it's ready. Some things you need to mull over. I actually have a therapist friend that we are really like thought partners. We ha we we really do have
Totally different goals and purpose here on this earth, right? But I think we we share a lot of these ideas that are not fully formed. But it's nice because she's one of those people that understands, like, I'm not selling you this for an opinion or feedback, or it's just more like a thought dump, and then I could just leave it there. But sometimes, like, that needs to be my journal. Sometimes that needs to be my prayer meditation. Like when I have an idea, I know that.
I need to just sit with it and just see like, is this something that could work? Is this something that I want?
Even like a title, a title at work, or it a lot of times we get sucked into I should want this, but do I want
Molly Bierman (09:14)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (09:14)
are are we quiet enough to like really mull it over? Because sometimes it's like I don't actually want that.
Molly Bierman (09:20)
Right, right.
Jill Griffin (09:21)
so sometimes we don't I don't I don't want to share that because I don't want the opinions about it.
Molly Bierman (09:26)
One hundred percent.
Jill Griffin (09:28)
Yeah.
Molly Bierman (09:28)
One hundred percent. Because I think what that creates is skepticism in ourselves.
Jill Griffin (09:33)
Yeah, especially for me if it's a big goal.
Molly Bierman (09:37)
Right. Right.
Jill Griffin (09:38)
I have started speaking out one of my goals publicly and I said to my husband this week, I said, it's gonna happen. It might not be now or ten years from now, but at some point like that that's where I'm headed.
Molly Bierman (09:49)
Great. Manifesting out here.
Jill Griffin (09:51)
I'm not sharing it just for all you listeners that are waiting for me to. I'm actually not sharing it here because I'm keeping it private. Practicing what we preach here.
Molly Bierman (09:59)
I feel like I would like to know though, so
Jill Griffin (10:00)
You'll know when we get there. You'll know when we get there.
Molly Bierman (10:03)
we can talk about that offline.
So what is a, a goal before it's ready? Some things need to be built before they can survive opinions.
I think for me, that means everything that I did around my business, right? Like, and as soon as I came out and talked about it, it was interesting because a lot of people went to other people to talk about it rather than coming to me. And I remember having a relationship that I was like, I'll never be in like I'll never actually like work with this colleague again. And I'll tell you what happened. So we had worked together for a long time, for like, you know, years. And
He decided that he was going to like talk about where I was headed and the state of our business and kind of like what was changing and what was evolving with somebody else who I have zero relationship with. And it's pretty known that I have zero relationship with that person, right? So I hit it head on. Like I don't we don't need to, we don't need to go around and dance. So I called. I
Jill Griffin (10:59)
playing these games. We're we're all adults.
Molly Bierman (11:02)
called and I was like, hey, do you have questions for me? I heard you've been asking about me.
Jill Griffin (11:07)
Kelly, what's good? Here I am.
Molly Bierman (11:07)
I heard you've been asking about the business.
Here I am. no, like I didn't mean to but but like all this dance. And I was like, okay, just wanted to let you know that like I do have a phone. Pretty sure you have my number. And if you need clarity on anything, you can feel free to come to me. And at that point.
Jill Griffin (11:25)
I bet he never did.
Molly Bierman (11:26)
He one, he never did. Two, I never worked with that person again.
And so that was it.
Jill Griffin (11:30)
Yeah.
Molly Bierman (11:31)
It was a wrap after that.
Jill Griffin (11:32)
That's also something I feel like is private now that you're talking about this, I've had a few people that have exited my life.
over this past year. And one, I had a really stark realization about.
Where I just remember this, this it was like the nail in the coffin with this, with this person. Something happened, and I immediately had the thought, like, nope, that's it. That they're cut off. And I have always felt compelled to share reasons when I am maybe once close to someone and then I'm
Molly Bierman (12:09)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (12:10)
Messing with you, you know, and the reasons, I don't need to share that. it really doesn't matter because at the end of the day, whether or not they know is actually not my business either. You should know. You know better. We're all adults here, but
Molly Bierman (12:24)
Right, right, right.
Jill Griffin (12:26)
I I don't need to put you on blast just because this relationship's no longer working, and also sometimes.
I can't mess with somebody anymore and I also don't always have to tell them. You know what I mean? Like sometimes we
Molly Bierman (12:38)
Right. Right. Yeah.
Jill Griffin (12:39)
can just have a fading away and
Molly Bierman (12:42)
Totally.
Jill Griffin (12:43)
it could just be that.
Molly Bierman (12:44)
Yeah, absolutely.
Wow. Guys, take a take a page out of the book, you know? I think it would it would go a lot easier for you.
Jill Griffin (12:53)
list that really jumps out at me too is your health and your grief, including how long either one is taking, like
Molly Bierman (13:00)
Guys, hands down, go back in the archives and listen to Megan Jarvis. Okay. Megan Reud and Jarvis.
Jill Griffin (13:05)
Yes.
Molly Bierman (13:06)
We did an episode on grief. You know, grief is a funny thing because it will hit you like a ton of bricks randomly on a Friday morning of a person you haven't thought about that's passed away in a decade.
It can be really, really dysregulating. look, I've been through a lot of grief in my life. I have lost an immense amount of friends, partners, family, but you know, as one does when we live in a world where addiction is really rampant and mental illness is
is really affecting a lot of people.
Jill Griffin (13:40)
I feel like when somebody exits our lives, like you get that Facebook
notification when something happens to them. Like, I don't know. I feel like
Molly Bierman (13:47)
Immediate.
Jill Griffin (13:48)
it I feel like yes, the grief is more palpable today because we're exposed to more.
Molly Bierman (13:54)
And I also feel like I was beating myself up enough that it was taking like, I can't tell you how many times Jill knows. I've had conversations with her a million times. Like, I can't believe I'm still talking about this, right? So if I'm feeling that way, I definitely don't feel like I want to be really that public about it because I feel like other people must be feeling that way too, right? So again, there's this you know, there's this ability to have this, less is more in terms of groups, friends.
Colleagues, less is more. That's my vote.
Jill Griffin (14:22)
The health thing for me sp I can speak to because I do feel like I privately suffered for I mean, I'm thinking about my neck.
Molly Bierman (14:30)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (14:32)
I mean, I was in pain for the better part of a year. We're gonna say like seven, eight months before I had like some sort of solution and feel like I came out of it. But
You know, I think the private part of it is like, yes, a trusted person people knew. I would say a couple of people really knew how much pain I was in. Sometimes when I keep things private, it's like I don't want to give more attention to it because I'm living it all the time or I'm
Actively trying not to focus on it because it's so
Molly Bierman (15:01)
Sure.
Jill Griffin (15:02)
it's demanding so much of my attention all the time where I'm just like sick of it. I get sick of it. I don't wanna, I don't wanna talk about this anymore, but I also know from being in recovery and being and doing this long enough that if I'm not talking about it, it's also gonna consume me.
Molly Bierman (15:19)
right, right.
Jill Griffin (15:20)
So
Molly Bierman (15:21)
And also just like, you know, i in addition to that, it's just chapters, what if what I've really kept close to is like chapters of our past, right? Like there was a time and place, and if you probably really dug into the archives, you could maybe find some old tapes that had a lot more chapters than have been revealed here on this podcast. Okay. But what I will tell you is that now
I'm kind of you know, I it helped it helped a lot of people in that stage of life and now I'm in a different stage of life and I'm a little bit more particular about what how how much of the chapter is on the table. That's just me.
Jill Griffin (15:57)
Yeah, Because again, it goes back to like, what is the purpose here? There are some women actually that need to hear some of those chapters. They need to know what's possible to get past. They need like it, there is a purpose there.
But some of it's just like, there's no reason. and I think it's okay to start getting comfortable if you're listening to this. Get comfortable saying to people, I'm not ready to talk about that. That one's just for me.
Molly Bierman (16:22)
Or
it's not my story to tell. That is like my
Jill Griffin (16:25)
That's a big one.
Molly Bierman (16:26)
that is my mantra. It's not my story to tell. And I really what I will tell you is in terms of oversharing or
I've talked about this. Oversharing, if I'm in a position where my inhibitions are a little bit lowered, aka I'm creeping towards bedtime. I've eaten way too much food, potentially had too much caffeine, and it's like an end of a night at a round table with like some colleagues or friends. There's a good possibility that is where the overshare is gonna happen. And I can tell you because I've experienced it. And then I do it, and then the next morning.
Jill Griffin (16:57)
I see it the next morning.
Molly Bierman (16:59)
And the next morning I wake up and I'm like, ooh, I should not
have said that, you know, and that is sober.
So that said, let's do a little rapid fire.
Jill Griffin (17:10)
Are you an oversharer or are you a vault?
Molly Bierman (17:13)
God, I I'm a vault with a lot of people. I'm an overshare with my closed circle. I'm both.
Jill Griffin (17:18)
Yeah,
it depends. It depends for me.
Molly Bierman (17:20)
You get great news, first call or sit with it. Same. We're telling each other usually.
Jill Griffin (17:24)
I'm telling people for sure. we're
out here. We're out here, yeah.
Something you used to share freely that you now keep.
Molly Bierman (17:33)
parts about my like addiction.
Jill Griffin (17:37)
Say I would say some of like my spiritual stuff. Like
Molly Bierman (17:42)
Mm.
Jill Griffin (17:43)
and what I and what I mean by that is my relationship with the universe, God, whatever you want to call it. yeah.
Molly Bierman (17:51)
I would agree with that. Who gets the unedited version of you?
Jill Griffin (17:54)
Probably more people than want than they want to have. I mean, people, I'm out here. full, full send, unedited most of the time.
There are times where I need to be a little bit more less of myself. And what I mean by that is putting the professional hat on or putting because sometimes I just say, I I'm I am unedited most of the time. And I think I've created a world in which I can be that. I don't need to perform a lot of the times, but just because I can doesn't mean I should.
Molly Bierman (18:28)
Right. One hundred percent.
Jill Griffin (18:29)
Mm.
Molly Bierman (18:30)
The nosiest question people ask women are,
Jill Griffin (18:31)
You didn't answer.
Molly Bierman (18:34)
sorry. Who gets the unedited version of me? my husband, Jill, my close girlfriends, not the whole world. I mean, my business partners at times. Yeah. It's like it's a circle.
the nosiest question people ask women our age, are you done having kids or are you perimetapausal? I don't know. I feel like that that's like it's pretty straightforward.
I wonder why.
Jill Griffin (19:12)
I get I mean, I feel like people ask me a lot of questions. Like I get I get DMs, but it's more like curious how it can how they can maybe implement something. Like I don't feel like it's no like intrusive.
Molly Bierman (19:24)
Listen,
to be clear, I was saying women our age, not us. I don't think anyone's asking us nosy questions because there is a barrier. There is a there is an like energetic barrier. Like I don't think people are just coming up to us asking us questions.
Jill Griffin (19:38)
You
know what though? I will say that I have had some intrusive questions from male business owners in this industry that think that like they they'll ask me stuff that I'm like, sir, sir,
Molly Bierman (19:48)
Please, we could talk a whole episode.
Jill Griffin (19:51)
you wouldn't ask that to your your peer colleague. So don't ask me. Don't
Molly Bierman (19:54)
Yeah, whole episode.
Jill Griffin (19:56)
and then and then try to act like I'm I'm something's wrong with me because I'm not answering your question. Please, sir. Back up. Back up.
Molly Bierman (20:03)
Sir.
your best one line deflection. god, I have a f quite a few. I feel like,
I I don't know. I think it's almost an energy of a not interested. I don't even think I need to say the words.
Jill Griffin (20:15)
I guess we'll just have to wait and see. I like this. That's me. I guess we'll just
Molly Bierman (20:19)
That it's that is that it's you.
Jill Griffin (20:22)
we're all just in for the surprise. Alan's living a a surprise every day of his life. He never knows what's next.
Molly Bierman (20:31)
So true.
Jill Griffin (20:33)
I actually recording this episode, I'm like, I can't wait. I can't wait to hard launch what I have going on in the background. And it's gonna be
What nobody expected.
Molly Bierman (20:43)
Can't wait. I don't know anyone an explanation really for anything. I don't know. For whether or not I I I think it's like, yeah,
Jill Griffin (20:48)
For my for saying no.
Molly Bierman (20:50)
for my yes or no. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally.
Jill Griffin (20:53)
Well, listen, I hope this was helpful for anything. And if I want everyone to try one thing this week. Like keep one good thing to yourself, even if it's for one day, two days. Like notice what it feels like to have something that's just yours. And just know that it's okay to to keep things close to the chest so that you can figure out where you're at with it before you do it. So
If you are not following us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, wherever you listen, please do that. And also follow us on Instagram at no permission necessary because all of Molly's vlogging is gonna be up there soon. So
Molly Bierman (21:30)
god.
Jill Griffin (21:30)
you should really follow along for the deets on what Molly's doing.
Molly Bierman (21:36)
God. Can't wait. Guys, until next week, thank you for following. As always. Thank you for being supports. Drop a comment. Tell us what you want to hear. And we'll see you next time.
