When Your Family Still Sees the Old You
Episode 56 with Jill Griffin & Molly Bierman
In this episode of No Permission Necessary, Jill and Molly explore how family systems can hold people in old roles, even after they have grown, healed, recovered, become parents, or started setting new boundaries.
They discuss the discomfort that can come from being seen as an older version of yourself, the loneliness of changing patterns within a family system, and the resentment that can build when people continue performing roles that no longer fit. Through examples from recovery, motherhood, family expectations, and communication, they reflect on what it means to step into a new identity without needing everyone else to fully understand it.
This episode is a reminder that you are allowed to stop performing in a role that no longer serves you.
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Jill Griffin (00:00)
Welcome back to No Permission Necessary. we are talking today about being unseen by the people who have known you the longest, like giving everyone permission to step into whatever their identity is when your old family identity keeps kind of replaying for the
Other members of the family.
And so let me explain a little bit. I when I was preparing for this episode, I thought a lot about early recovery, honestly. Just because I feel like when one person starts getting well, we really start highlighting how the system maybe needs to change. That that definitely showed up. However
Molly Bierman (00:51)
Mm-hmm.
Ha yes.
Jill Griffin (01:01)
I feel like I'm going through a little bit of this right now, but it's different because I feel like when I stepped into my identity as a mother, and this happens a lot with the clients that I serve, like when you become a parent, your family system stuff gets highlighted in a different way as well. and you start making choices of how you want to show up in your role in the family, because
You know, sometimes you can't continue operating in the same way when you're trying to do something different, break some of those generational trauma bonds and, you know, all all that stuff.
Molly Bierman (01:37)
There's a couple things that I think are important to mention. One is when you're first entering recovery and you have been historically the problem, as I was. and as Jill was, I'll speak for her.
It is confusing for people to be able to coexist with you when you're in a different space. I think that it plays on their stuff, it plays on you know, not knowing, not trusting, haven't really forgiven. There's still a lot of resentment and chaos. And so there's this kind of displaced challenge in both sides where
When you have a loved one that gets well or starts to get sober or starts to be put in recovery in any form, whatever recovery they're entering, the natural desire is to want to go spend time with that person. You're like, well, now I can go spend time. I don't want to be at a distance from them. I want to be connected to them. But what happens is if both people haven't done their own process or their own journey.
That stuff really shows up even more glaring because now there's nothing to blame, right? I mean, there's still the there's still the past events and the past like ruptures and you know the lying and the deception and the deceit and all that good stuff. But well, not good, you know, all that bad stuff. But there's not
Jill Griffin (02:45)
Yeah.
Molly Bierman (02:58)
That act going on currently. And so I really based on my own experience, I think the biggest struggle was I was starting to feel better about myself. And then when I was coming around my family, I actually felt worse. So I liked to stay in this like recovery bubble that I was in because it made me feel.
More comfortable, more confident. When I would get around my family, I would feel like, my, confidence would drop, or my my flaws would be shining through, or my confidence would start to kind of waver, you know? So I I just feel like there's such a
Confusion, I guess is the best word, around how you show up with your family when you're going through some level of a transition, whether that's into recovery or maybe changing from being a child to then being a young adult, to then being a married adult, to then being a mother.
or father, those are all really tough transitions really for the family. Yeah.
Jill Griffin (04:02)
In a system, yeah. Well,
especially if I I just think about the culture of a family, and every family has one, whatever that culture is, right? And so i if we look at what that is and you are stepping into your own identity, whether it's part of one of those natural transitions or maybe you know.
Where I see this a lot, honestly, is in somebody's health journey. So I feel like sobriety is one of those things, but let's just say that, you know, you start into a health journey and you're eating differently. You're prioritizing your sleep. You're saying no to certain things like drinking. I mean, even if you're not sober, I feel like there is a big movement around people saying no to drinking for health reasons. And that's not always
You know, like your family hasn't met that new you yet. They're not used to that. So they don't know what to do. And especially when I was new in recovery, I remember being around some family members or friends who they were uncomfortable and a little threatened by my sobriety because then it highlighted their drinking in their minds. Not for me, but for them, they had to take a different look at that. And I also think that when you step into
This new role, it's a little lonely when you have to be the one setting the boundaries. And I'll give an example. I got sober right before the holidays. And so
I had to do a lot of thinking about how I was gonna show up for the holidays, what that was gonna look like. And I set some pretty firm boundaries around the time that I was willing to spend in certain situations, just because drinking's big part of my family's culture. I think most families' cultures, especially around holidays. Although the older I've gotten and the more sober I've gotten, I've realized that that's actually not true. Like some families they don't they don't drink at all on the holidays,
highlight, right? And so when you talk about why it's lonely, it's like, well, I had to be the one to set the boundary because it was me that was changing my behaviors, right? So I had to say no. And I also think that was difficult for my family because on the one hand, they want to be supportive, but on the other hand, you have to think about I haven't been at previous holidays because I was.
active. I wasn't able to show up, right? So your family wants to like show off that you're healthier now and like you're able to be part of the family and all this stuff, but it's like reconciling what's best for you and and your new identity that you're showing up for. And like, I don't know,
I feel like sometimes when we start setting boundaries, we are breaking down some of those old patterns. Because when you're a child or you know, you're in a family system, sometimes you get in the role of just being like, Yeah, I'll do that, to appease everyone in the family, to make everyone happy, like, I'll do that. And sometimes when you start stepping into the new part of you, you're like, No, I can't do that. And that's tough sometimes to hear.
Molly Bierman (07:14)
You know, I was having a conversation earlier in the week with a family and a lot of what we talk about is how one has to prioritize while also validating that someone else's feelings matter and that the connections are yearning to be repaired. And so the best example I have around that was that early on in my recovery I worked in the restaurant industry because it was good money and you know, I could work a couple nights and still,
you know, practice my recovery during the day or in the evenings or whatever it was and, you know, hit all my groups and meetings And if you've ever worked in the restaurant industry, you know that like the holidays are big deal. So the, you know, the holiday before the holiday, the days leading up to the holiday for different, you know, corporate parties and work parties and, you know, family get-togethers. And
I was in a position where I didn't really have the resources to just be able to come and go and like leave my job when I was fully responsible for my own financial security. But there was this really like tough position that I was in because my mom specifically, I think my dad too, but my mom specifically, I remember having a conversation with her, and she'd be like, Are you coming home
And I'd be like, I can't. And it was the first time I was I had to like say no while also knowing that it was gonna be hard for her. And it wasn't necessarily something that I really wanted to do. Like I did wanna go home.
But not sacrificing, because historically I would sacrifice and say, okay, I'll make it work and I'll s you know, I'll tell work I can't work and then I'll come up. But that would put have been putting a financial strain on my ability to, you know, at the time, maybe make rent or pay my cell phone bill or whatever like few bills I had. But those few bills were my livelihood, you know? Like if I didn't have those, I was in big tr if I don't have money to make those bills, I was in big trouble. And so I think what happens is parallel.
To people being able to reassign kind of their role in the family and maybe shy away from being the people pleaser or being the person who's like overly, kind of controlling around certain things or absent in certain ways, like whatever role kind of they've played throughout their life. I think the biggest thing for me was that as I started to get well, my confidence started to raise and I was able to handle the letdown.
I think the people, the reason why people don't want to say the hard thing or, make the subtle shift is because they feel like they can't handle the letdown of the other person. So they're willing to say, I'm gonna let myself down to preserve the relationship, you know? And that really becomes disproportionate and really becomes challenging if you wanna have.
Jill Griffin (09:51)
Yeah.
Molly Bierman (10:00)
A relationship that is reciprocal, built on transparency and lacks resentment.
Jill Griffin (10:04)
Yeah, I've had a a recent conversation with somebody about this where it was very apparent after s talking this through that there needed to be some really tough conversations with the family member. And what it boiled down to is I don't want to upset them.
And that was which is kind of what you're saying, right? Like I the pattern is I sacrifice myself, then I get resentful, right? Like that's like a whole cycle, especially if you're an an alcoholic or an addict in recovery or not.
Molly Bierman (10:31)
Totally.
Jill Griffin (10:36)
But this plays out in so many forms. And so I would I would couch that under some sort of people pleasing behavior, but also it's it's conflict avoidance, right? It's like because especially in a family system, you know the fallout from that. And I think that we all make calculated decisions on when we lay on the sword for the good of like keeping the peace. I I think we all make those decisions.
Molly Bierman (10:59)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (11:02)
Regardless if you're a people pleaser or not, like that's just part of being in relationship with people sometimes. Like there is sacrifice in relationship, right? And so there are times, despite whatever your best boundary, you're like, I'm gonna do this thing because it's just like easier to do it. But when you repeatedly do that and abandon yourself, that's when it becomes a problem because now
The other person may not even know that you're kind of abandoning your own boundaries or yourself in this process. Like they may think you want to be doing this, or like you're all on board and you're all on the same page. And so, when we really sit with ourselves to say, What is the thing that's bothering me? And you kind of unpack the layers.
When we're not being honest with those people in our lives about, well, this is how I want to show up now and this is what it requires in our relationship. And I've had to have those tough conversations since becoming a parent. I feel like that's been the next layer of like the identity transition for me. And that continues with all the things on my plate. But what we came to with this conversation that I had with this person is like, you gotta sit down and have this tough conversation.
The problem is, and we had to kind of walk this through, sometimes the other person's gonna see it differently and they're not gonna be on the same page with how you want to kind of show up in the world. And then what?
Molly Bierman (12:30)
Well, I mean I've had this general rule, I guess, or guiding principle, I think is a better word. That I can still accept people for where they are, even if it doesn't align with
What I think. I mean, essentially. I mean, I think that's everything that recovery talks to us about and speaks to. So that applies not only in a family system, but also in a work system, also in a a friend group, that it's okay if they don't align, right? Like I can still make my decision.
And I'm not talking about a misalignment in values, right? Like then you're probably that's a different subject. But I can say, okay, this is their stuff, right? It's not mine. Like I can make my peace with it and
I mean, I can say that I feel like I did everything in my capacity to make that person feel included. And if they're still not feeling included, then maybe that's something that they need to look at independently.
you know, like I own my part, I take care of my actions, I try to look around all sides to ensure that I did that. And if I haven't been and if I haven't been able to do that, apologize naturally. But if I have been able to do that, then if there's some sort of like feeling or stuck feeling in the relationship or feeling like there's a misalignment, then at that point it really is for the other person to kind of look around their own area. I mean I
Jill Griffin (13:50)
And yeah, and there's gonna be
natural consequences to that. So I guess you can't argue someone into seeing you differently. I I think if you're trying to do show up differently, you're trying to change the dynamic, whether it's in a relationship or really it's just the boundary. So like something that comes up for me is like what I'm willing to do or not do with the busy schedule of my my own family. So like my core.
immediate family, my husband and my children, right? So once the kids started getting into activities and they're what they wanna do now, like they're not just little children that I can cart everywhere that I things I want to do. Like they have their own voice and interest now too. And
You know, my husband and I made made a decision that like this is what matters the most. So like This is the North Star. Like this is what we do. And so that means that they get a voice in what the priorities are for the family, including whether we show up for family events sometimes, right? Like sometimes there not sometimes, most of the time there is competing priorities that we have to choose what we are going to do.
Molly Bierman (14:35)
Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (14:57)
At any given time. And growing up, being at the family event, that's like you're there. You don't say no to that. You show up for that. Like if there's something else going on, you don't do that thing, right? but to some extent, like I played travel sports and we had stuff that was our priority too. So to some extent, growing up, I'm sure my parents said no to things growing up, but still, it's been a process to be able to say.
No, we're not doing that thing. Especially if the reason is just simply we don't want to. Like if there's no other reason besides it's been a long week, we've been out of the house every day, like we really just want to stay at the house and like must be nice. There's a response, you know.
I mean, yeah, it is nice to make a choice. And that's fine. I think you can't argue with someone seeing it differently on their end. That's where it becomes no longer if I'm doing it in a respectful way. I've kind of laid this out. This is my boundary. I just have to keep showing up and being consistent in that messaging and like what I'm doing. I don't have to continue beating it into somebody that like this is this is how it is now. a great example is my aunt this week or the past few weeks.
Molly Bierman (15:41)
Yeah, and that's okay. Right, right, right.
Jill Griffin (16:09)
When I'm crowned as I guess the family scheduler, like I'm the one that has to make sure everyone knows every single game, location of every game, which if you're a parent with children in sports at this point, you know I you're that's like five different dates and locations at a minimum every week.
Molly Bierman (16:29)
Mm-hmm,
mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (16:31)
I shared the link to the app with everything on there. If you didn't download it and get the schedule, like that's kind of where it ends for me. Like I was sending in them out at one point, but what happened is it set up this expectation that I was going to do it every week. So then when it wasn't done, twice in the last month I've gotten reamed out. Well, I I would have been here if.
You know, and it's so important to me. If it's so important to you, then it sounds like there needs to be a change in your behavior because I'm doing all I can do and I don't know what else I can do. I've shared the link. I have a few things going on, few balls that I'm juggling. So like I'm
Molly Bierman (17:11)
Yeah, but think that
that's that's the deal because I feel like we have been able to relate on this so much. I have historically been a planner. I still am a planner to a very large extent. But obviously now it involves my own kids. but there's still this expectation. Talk about family roles. There is still this expectation.
Jill Griffin (17:27)
Yeah.
Molly Bierman (17:35)
that I'm gonna coordinate everything, which to be fair, I kind of set myself up for that because I always did it. And now I'm trying to kind of like back out a little bit and like, okay, pass the baton, someone else can like take some initiative here too. And it's not going well.
Jill Griffin (17:50)
How's that working for you?
For you or for everybody else?
Molly Bierman (17:55)
For everybody and me.
For for all of us, honestly. I mean
Jill Griffin (17:59)
Well, I
can imagine that the part that's not going well for you is they're not doing it as well as you do it. So like then you're having problems with the outcome.
Molly Bierman (18:08)
But I no, I yes, of course, naturally. But I I also, you know, it is a little bit in my DNA. So it is unwinding my own role too. Like I don't n necessarily need to put that pressure on anybody else other than myself. And I think maybe it means more proactive conversation. It means talking about it before maybe something, you know, before we're getting together, acknowledging bandwidth. A lot of things in that.
In that regard, right? Like acknowledging what I have to give, what I don't have to give. But when you are roughly five years old and you are calling around your family members on the landline in the kitchen to plan and let them know that you're making a dinner reservation for everybody.
I'm not sure I'm able to back out of the role. Like that truly was me in my essence. I mean, coordinating everything from talent shows to get togethers. And now I will tell you, Bodhi has got that gene because he will now talk about transitions. Okay, going back to our initial topic.
Jill Griffin (18:55)
It's just
I I mean
Molly Bierman (19:22)
I had to put the chime on the door because now he's out. He's just out. He has gone to the neighbors. He is going to orchestrate his own playdate. He has no interest in me doing it for him. And he's ready to party. He is ready to and he now he's calling on the landline. Now he's calling on the landline, not at on Fridays. Like I don't know if he just always like subconsciously knows Friday's like going into the weekend or whatever.
Jill Griffin (19:32)
Yeah.
I mean speaking of party.
Molly Bierman (19:51)
He'll call f he'll call Sam on the landline and say, Dad, we're going out to dinner tonight. I'll see you when you get home and hang on the phone and then comes to me and then says, Dad said we're going out to dinner
Jill Griffin (20:05)
Well, that might be a little bit more manipulation.
Molly Bierman (20:10)
He I think he's like, yeah, dad said yes. It's not like he's intentionally trying to manipulate me. He's just like, this is what we're doing, and I'm excited about it.
Jill Griffin (20:19)
Well I mean my daughter just planned her entire birthday party. I
Molly Bierman (20:23)
Okay, so she's
now taking the baton. Do you think we should warn them? Do you think that we should warn them?
Jill Griffin (20:29)
I I don't think it's so much about the role, right? I think it's about when we choose, because I think there's times in our lives where, which is where we're at right now, we can't continue this role and keep our sanity. Like we can't do both because we're already holding all of the pro like all of these things for our own family system. We can't then coordinate the full family system, right? And I think par it's more about
not needing them to understand when we set the boundary, right? So when when they when people in our lives, particularly family, because that's when I think it's the hardest, when we're not being seen by them, we're being misunderstood, they don't really, I don't even know that it's about respecting the boundaries. They just don't see the value in why we're showing up in a different way.
Molly Bierman (21:01)
Yes, I would agree. Sure.
Jill Griffin (21:24)
I think really what we're trying to say is you don't need them to understand for you to continue to do what feels right for you in whatever season that you're in. I mean, that's what I got out of, especially these last couple of weeks, when I was like, I finally said, like, I don't need her to understand how busy I am or the why behind it. It's just a no for me. I cannot promise you anything more than what I'm doing right now. Like
I feel like I'm thriving. I don't feel like I'm burnt out. But the reality is if I keep putting these expectations on myself to continue in these roles that other people are expecting me to fill, I will be. And that's the boundary. I'm not trying to show up in my life like that today.
And I feel like when you're setting that boundary for people who are in that role of overdoing no matter what, not checking in with themselves, like, you know, If they're not willing to look at their parts, like that's not really on me.
Molly Bierman (22:19)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Jill Griffin (22:21)
And we need to be okay with that.
Molly Bierman (22:23)
So permission to
Jill Griffin (22:25)
Who permission to stop performing in a role that no longer serves you.
Molly Bierman (22:30)
Yeah.
Jill Griffin (22:31)
That's it.
Molly Bierman (22:32)
I don't know, I feel like also
It doesn't always have to make sense. You know, sometimes I can say, like, well, my head isn't really aligned with what I'm feeling, right? Like, and so it doesn't always have to make sense because your old roles are going to tell you something else, right? They're going to lead you back to, well, this is how it's always been done, right? But if it's feeling dysregulated, if it's feeling uncomfortable, if it's feeling like out of alignment, then like you have your answer, you know?
Jill Griffin (22:58)
Yeah.
Molly Bierman (23:03)
So baby steps.
Jill Griffin (23:05)
Families are hard. It's like no matter what, when you get around that table sometimes, like you're back to being a thirteen year old. Like it does not matter.
Molly Bierman (23:13)
Totally. It does
not matter. Why is that?
Jill Griffin (23:19)
It's that inner child that that there's it just is a signal there's some stuff there. not it does it doesn't mean doesn't mean a bad thing sometimes. It's just like how we show up, you know?
Molly Bierman (23:24)
Plug for EMDR.
No.
Yeah, absolutely. Well, guys, feel free to give feedback on roles that you're living in, roles that you want to shed, and how we might be able to support and continue to have topics that align with your growth. Until next time.
Jill Griffin (23:46)
Peace.
